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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Jim: Great example of yet another false
dichotomy.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=jmcgrath@missoulahousing.org
href="mailto:jmcgrath@missoulahousing.org">Jim McGrath</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=marler@bigsky.net
href="mailto:marler@bigsky.net">Marilyn Marler</A> ; <A
title=JWiener@ci.missoula.mt.us href="mailto:JWiener@ci.missoula.mt.us">Jason
Wiener</A> ; <A title=missoulagov@cmslists.com
href="mailto:missoulagov@cmslists.com">missoulagov@cmslists.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, January 30, 2009 12:24
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> RE: [MissoulaGov] cats &
dogs & stewardship</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I would rather live
in a community that provides more and better housing, safe neighborhoods,
effective and clean transportation choices etc. but allows cats outside even
though they kill song birds. I would rather not live in a community whose
leaders take great pains to regulate cats but does nothing much for housing,
transportation, crime etc. <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=Section1>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">But that’s me. You
may have your own priorities.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><FONT
face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'">
<HR tabIndex=-1 align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">
missoulagov-bounces@cmslists.com [mailto:missoulagov-bounces@cmslists.com]
<B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of </SPAN></B>Marilyn
Marler<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Friday, January
30, 2009 11:16 AM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> Jason
Wiener; missoulagov@cmslists.com<BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> [MissoulaGov] cats & dogs
& stewardship</SPAN></FONT><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Calibri size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> Now that I've
taken a full day to decompress from Bob's description of the "dogs off leash"
discussion, I can cheerfully say that, unlike Jason (apparently) I *did* run
for council at least in part because of my interest in conservation issues and
good stewardship of natural areas and wildlife.</SPAN></FONT><FONT
face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> Cats roaming
free in town *do* have negative impacts to native wildlife. They kill a lot of
birds. If only we could train them to kill starlings and house sparrows, but
we can't. They just as happily eat migratory warblers or northern flickers
(our neighbors' cat killed a flicker just recently). Birds have enough issues
with habitat loss; do we have to also accept that our pets "need" to eat
them? Cats can hunt even with bells, even if they are de-clawed. You
might not see it, but it happens. Denial is not a river in
<st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place
w:st="on">Egypt</st1:place></st1:country-region>, as they say. And I'm
not even getting into general bad cat behavior like pooping in garden beds and
so on, which is a legitimate quality of life issue. We need to move towards
cats as indoor pets, although I don't think its appropriate
for government to require it. You can't have it both ways- be an
advocate of local wildlife and an advocate of outdoor unsupervised cats.
(note: I have 3 rescued cats who I love dearly).</SPAN></FONT><FONT
face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> Dogs off leash
in our conservation areas *do* have negative impacts to native wildlife.
One person wrote to this list serve that she saw "only" 8 incidents
per year of dogs harrassing wildlife. I did some math and if one person
who spends 520 hours per year on one area of open space sees 8 incidents per
year, and you expand that to cover 8 hours a day for 260 days, and then expand
that to 4 conservation areas (North Hills, Mt Sentinel, L trail, Lincoln
Hills), then someone's dog is harassing wildlife about avery 3rd day. I
think that is very conservative because 1) a lot happens out of eyesight, and
2) there are more than 8 hours per day that people are walking dogs on
conservation areas, and 3) you could probably divide those conservation areas
each again for a multiplyer of 8 instead of 4. So conservatively, every
other day.</SPAN></FONT><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> Bob, you
included some obnoxiuos descriptions of arguements in favor of leashed
dogs. You did not include Pam's suggestion that dogs off leash harassing
wildlife might be a positive thing because we have too many urban deer.
If we are going to do something about our urban deer population, I really hope
we can aspire to do something humane and productive, rather than letting dogs
run them to death.</SPAN></FONT><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> Again, I'm only
focusing on conservation/stewardship issues here. Not social issues of whether
I want someone's dog tripping me while I'm out for a run (as happens almost
every time I run on the river trail which is technically a leash area but I'm
good natured so I deal with it), or stealing my food when I'm working on Mt
Sentinel. (note: I love dogs)</SPAN></FONT><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> And I'll close
with something that is more of a topic for a book I'm writing in my head- Can
we please start moving beyond a false dichotomy of Human Influenced vs Non
Human Influenced places? The world is human influenced. Let's make
mindful choices always. We CAN have our pets but respect wildlife. We CAN
have landscaping that makes room for biodiversity and
wildlife. It's old fashioned to think of humans as only having
detrimental effects on nature. 2 good books I'm reading now (for those
of you looking for winter reading): <A
href="http://www.amazon.com/Sunflower-Forest-Ecological-Restoration-Communion/dp/0520233204/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1233337878&sr=8-1">The
Sunflower Forest </A>and </SPAN></FONT><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'"><A
href="%20http://www.amazon.com/Bringing-Nature-Home-Sustain-Wildlife/dp/0881928542/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1233337931&sr=1-1"><FONT
face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Bringing
Nature Home</SPAN></FONT></A>. </SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Arial
size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Thanks for listening
to my thoughts on this. Marilyn</SPAN></FONT><FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN: 5pt 0in 5pt 3.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: black 1.5pt solid; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none">
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">----- Original Message -----
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV style="font-color: black">
<P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4"><B><FONT face=Arial
size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> <A
title=JWiener@ci.missoula.mt.us
href="mailto:JWiener@ci.missoula.mt.us">Jason Wiener</A>
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">To:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> <A
title=missoulagov@cmslists.com
href="mailto:missoulagov@cmslists.com">missoulagov@cmslists.com</A>
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Sent:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">
Thursday, January 29, 2009 9:10 PM<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Subject:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> Re:
[MissoulaGov] committee update 1-28-09<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Times New Roman'"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Calibri color=#1f497d size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d">Amen. Though I will eventually have
to do so, I sure didn't run because I wanted to spend time regulating the
presence, absence or behavior of small animals. I guess the chicken shit
should have tipped me off though, huh? <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Calibri color=#1f497d size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>