[MissoulaGov] Parking Kiosks
Jeremy Keene
JKeene at wgmgroup.com
Mon Dec 7 14:19:17 MST 2009
North Higgins project info can be viewed at www.wgmgroup.com. Click on
the link on the left under projects.
Jeremy Keene, P.E., LEED AP
Principal Engineer
WGM Group, Inc.
http://www.wgmgroup.com <http://www.wgmgroup.com/>
________________________________
From: missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com
[mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com] On Behalf Of Suzanne Sherman
Aboulfadl
Sent: Monday, December 07, 2009 2:12 PM
To: Brent Campbell
Cc: Sally Brown; missoulagov at cmslists.com
Subject: Re: [MissoulaGov] Parking Kiosks
Is there a website link to the parking management documents? Great
holiday reading that I hadn't considered before. Also, where could I
find info on the bike lanes on North Higgins? I got in on the middle of
that discussion and don't know what the original proposals are -- I've
only read the responses.
Suzanne
On Mon, Dec 7, 2009 at 1:53 PM, Brent Campbell <BCampbell at wgmgroup.com>
wrote:
Sally,
There are numerous good books on the importance on parking
management as
it relates to good land planning. "The High Cost of Free
Parking" would
be a good place to start. There were also several documents
prepared on
recommended parking management strategies prepared for the
Downtown
masterplan. We need people engaged and informed on the issues.
Parking
seems to illicit passions second only to depriving someone of
oxygen.
Brent Campbell, P.E.
President / CEO
WGM Group, Inc.
http://www.wgmgroup.com <http://www.wgmgroup.com/>
-----Original Message-----
From: Sally Brown [mailto:sallybrown6 at gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, December 07, 2009 1:38 PM
To: Jordan Hess
Cc: Brent Campbell; missoulagov at cmslists.com
Subject: Re: [MissoulaGov] Parking Kiosks
What! No free parking with the free lunch?
This makes sense. Why, then, is it only the downtown area that
has
parking meters. How does the city get it's money out of the
free large
parking lots surrounding the urban core?
Jordan Hess wrote:
> Sally:
>
> There is no such thing as free parking. Ever. Even the parking
at
> Wal-Mart is highly subsidized in the form of infrastructure
> improvements the the city has to foot the bill for (such as
the idea
> of adding a second left turn lane from Reserve to Mullan).
>
> If parking in the urban core is free, than it will be taken up
by
> people parking for a long period of time, such as employees or
area
> residents and it won't be available for customers of downtown
> businesses or for folks stoping by government offices. There
are many
> ways to properly price downtown parking to make it hassle-free
and
> affordable. If parking were free, I believe it would actually
be a
> strain on downtown businesses because less would be available
to their
> customers. It would certainly be a strain on city budgets.
>
> Thanks,
> Jordan Hess
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Dec 7, 2009 at 12:19 PM, Sally Brown
<sallybrown6 at gmail.com
> <mailto:sallybrown6 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> I don't like, do not want, will not agree in any manner to
parking
> kiosks. They are difficult to use for anyone other than
those
> with extra time, correct change, nothing in their hands,
no small
> children in tow, or other encumbrances.
> I am hoping that we are moving in the direction of free
downtown
> parking.
>
> Parking kiosks are a sign that you may have lost your
senses.
>
>
> Sally Brown
>
>
>
>
>
> Brent Campbell wrote:
>
> Reports from Portland indicate a 25 % increase in
revenue
> from the
> electronic kiosks. This should be confirmed by our
parking
> consultants
> and if true, this could be important bonding revenue
for the
new
> structures identified in the downtown masterplan.
>
> Brent Campbell, P.E.
> President / CEO
> WGM Group, Inc.
> http://www.wgmgroup.com <http://www.wgmgroup.com/>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com
> <mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com>
> [mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com
> <mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com>] On Behalf
Of
> missoulagov-request at cmslists.com
> <mailto:missoulagov-request at cmslists.com>
> Sent: Monday, December 07, 2009 12:00 PM
> To: missoulagov at cmslists.com
<mailto:missoulagov at cmslists.com>
> Subject: MissoulaGov Digest, Vol 46, Issue 5
>
> Send MissoulaGov mailing list submissions to
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> specific than
> "Re: Contents of MissoulaGov digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: parking meters (Rod Austin)
> 2. Re: parking meters (Jim McGrath)
> 3. Re: parking meters (Rod Austin)
> 4. Re: Committee Update 12-2-09 (parking meters)
(Michael
> Loftis)
> 5. Re: parking meters (Ed Childers)
>
>
>
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 7 Dec 2009 08:13:34 -0700
> From: "Rod Austin" <raustin at missouladowntownbid.org
> <mailto:raustin at missouladowntownbid.org>>
> Subject: Re: [MissoulaGov] parking meters
> To: "'Derek Goldman'" <derekmgold at hotmail.com
> <mailto:derekmgold at hotmail.com>>,
> <echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us
> <mailto:echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us>>,
<srye at montana.com
> <mailto:srye at montana.com>>
> Cc: missoulagov at cmslists.com
<mailto:missoulagov at cmslists.com>
> Message-ID: <002701ca774f$d9c1d100$8d457300$@org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Who pays the power bill? Or would that come with your
parking
> fee? Rod
>
>
> From: missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com
> <mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com>
> [mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com
> <mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com>] On Behalf
Of Derek
> Goldman
> Sent: Saturday, December 05, 2009 2:22 PM
> To: echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us
> <mailto:echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us>; srye at montana.com
> <mailto:srye at montana.com>
> Cc: missoulagov at cmslists.com
<mailto:missoulagov at cmslists.com>
> Subject: Re: [MissoulaGov] parking meters
>
>
> i wish we had a "like" button...
>
>
>
> _____
> Date: Sat, 5 Dec 2009 09:12:42 -0700
> From: echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us
> <mailto:echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us>
> To: srye at montana.com <mailto:srye at montana.com>
> CC: missoulagov at cmslists.com
<mailto:missoulagov at cmslists.com>
> Subject: Re: [MissoulaGov] parking meters
>
> I predict: in as little as five years we will be
looking back
> wishing
> our parking meters doubled as plug-ins for our fleet
of
electric
> vehicles.
>
> Ed Childers
>
>
> Stacy Rye wrote:
> Rod,
>
>
> It's not the changing of habits that's the issue, it's
that
> kiosks are
>
>
> inconvenient, and they could be difficult for tourists
and
> perhaps a
>
>
> question of if it's not broke . . .
>
>
>
>
>
> I think the council needs to hear about this if new
parking
> meters/kiosks
>
>
> are proposed.
>
>
>
>
>
> Stacy
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> There are many issues to think through on what
actually gets
> put on the
>
>
> street. There are other more modern ways than the
multi space
> meters and
>
>
> we
>
>
> will be exploring all of them. I think the feeling is
that
> with the new
>
>
> streetscape it would be nice to clean it up even more.
And
> frankly I
> don't
>
>
> think it would be that difficult to change habits. At
my age I
> sometimes
>
>
> take change hard but do try to stay open to it.
>
>
>
>
>
> I do have to say that everyone's input is interesting
(I am a
> little
>
>
> surprised) and noted.
>
>
>
>
>
> Rod
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Messages and attachments sent to or from this e-mail
account
> pertaining
> to City business may be considered public or private
records
> depending
> on the message content. The City is often required by
law to
> provide
> public records to individuals requesting them. The
City is
> also required
> by law to protect private, confidential information.
This
> message is
> intended for the use of the individual or entity named
above.
> If you are
> not the intended recipient of this transmission,
please notify
the
> sender immediately, do not forward the message to
anyone, and
> delete all
> copies. Thank you
>
>
> _____
> Windows LiveT Hotmail is faster and more secure than
ever.
> Learn more.
>
<http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowslive/hotmail_bl1/hotmail_bl1.as
> px?o
> cid=PID23879::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-ww:WM_IMHM_1:092009>
> -------------- next part --------------
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>
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> 0201/attachment.html>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 7 Dec 2009 08:30:12 -0700
> From: "Jim McGrath" <jmcgrath at missoulahousing.org
> <mailto:jmcgrath at missoulahousing.org>>
> Subject: Re: [MissoulaGov] parking meters
> To: "Rod Austin" <raustin at missouladowntownbid.org
> <mailto:raustin at missouladowntownbid.org>>, "Derek
Goldman"
> <derekmgold at hotmail.com
> <mailto:derekmgold at hotmail.com>>,
<echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us
> <mailto:echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us>>,
> <srye at montana.com <mailto:srye at montana.com>>
> Cc: missoulagov at cmslists.com
<mailto:missoulagov at cmslists.com>
> Message-ID:
>
<92B4830B2B5E6E43B04109A6DFB96F96F8297E at mha1.MHA.local>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Solar!
>
>
> From: missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com
> <mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com>
> [mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com
> <mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com>] On Behalf
Of Rod
Austin
> Sent: Monday, December 07, 2009 8:14 AM
> To: 'Derek Goldman'; echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us
> <mailto:echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us>; srye at montana.com
> <mailto:srye at montana.com>
> Cc: missoulagov at cmslists.com
<mailto:missoulagov at cmslists.com>
> Subject: Re: [MissoulaGov] parking meters
>
>
> Who pays the power bill? Or would that come with your
parking
> fee? Rod
>
>
> From: missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com
> <mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com>
> [mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com
> <mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com>] On Behalf
Of Derek
> Goldman
> Sent: Saturday, December 05, 2009 2:22 PM
> To: echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us
> <mailto:echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us>; srye at montana.com
> <mailto:srye at montana.com>
> Cc: missoulagov at cmslists.com
<mailto:missoulagov at cmslists.com>
> Subject: Re: [MissoulaGov] parking meters
>
>
> i wish we had a "like" button...
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> Date: Sat, 5 Dec 2009 09:12:42 -0700
> From: echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us
> <mailto:echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us>
> To: srye at montana.com <mailto:srye at montana.com>
> CC: missoulagov at cmslists.com
<mailto:missoulagov at cmslists.com>
> Subject: Re: [MissoulaGov] parking meters
>
> I predict: in as little as five years we will be
looking back
> wishing
> our parking meters doubled as plug-ins for our fleet
of
electric
> vehicles.
>
> Ed Childers
>
>
> Stacy Rye wrote:
> Rod,
>
>
>
>
> It's not the changing of habits that's the issue, it's
that
> kiosks are
>
>
>
>
> inconvenient, and they could be difficult for tourists
and
> perhaps a
>
>
>
>
> question of if it's not broke . . .
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I think the council needs to hear about this if new
parking
> meters/kiosks
>
>
>
>
> are proposed.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Stacy
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> There are many issues to think through on what
actually
> gets put
> on the
>
>
>
>
> street. There are other more modern ways than
the multi
> space
> meters and
>
>
>
>
> we
>
>
>
>
> will be exploring all of them. I think the
feeling is
> that with
> the new
>
>
>
>
> streetscape it would be nice to clean it up
even more.
And
> frankly I don't
>
>
>
>
> think it would be that difficult to change
habits. At
> my age I
> sometimes
>
>
>
>
> take change hard but do try to stay open to it.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I do have to say that everyone's input is
interesting
> (I am a
> little
>
>
>
>
> surprised) and noted.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Rod
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Messages and attachments sent to or from this e-mail
account
> pertaining
> to City business may be considered public or private
records
> depending
> on the message content. The City is often required by
law to
> provide
> public records to individuals requesting them. The
City is
> also required
> by law to protect private, confidential information.
This
> message is
> intended for the use of the individual or entity named
above.
> If you are
> not the intended recipient of this transmission,
please notify
the
> sender immediately, do not forward the message to
anyone, and
> delete all
> copies. Thank you
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> Windows LiveT Hotmail is faster and more secure than
ever.
> Learn more.
>
<http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowslive/hotmail_bl1/hotmail_bl1.as
>
px?ocid=PID23879::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-ww:WM_IMHM_1:092009>
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
>
<http://www.cmslists.com/pipermail/missoulagov/attachments/20091207/6ca3
> 86e1/attachment-0001.htm>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 7 Dec 2009 08:41:05 -0700
> From: "Rod Austin" <raustin at missouladowntownbid.org
> <mailto:raustin at missouladowntownbid.org>>
> Subject: Re: [MissoulaGov] parking meters
> To: "'Jim McGrath'" <jmcgrath at missoulahousing.org
> <mailto:jmcgrath at missoulahousing.org>>, "'Derek
> Goldman'"
> <derekmgold at hotmail.com
> <mailto:derekmgold at hotmail.com>>,
<echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us
> <mailto:echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us>>,
> <srye at montana.com <mailto:srye at montana.com>>
> Cc: missoulagov at cmslists.com
<mailto:missoulagov at cmslists.com>
> Message-ID: <003501ca7753$b134d120$139e7360$@org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> I'm there!
>
>
> From: Jim McGrath [mailto:jmcgrath at missoulahousing.org
> <mailto:jmcgrath at missoulahousing.org>]
> Sent: Monday, December 07, 2009 8:30 AM
> To: Rod Austin; Derek Goldman;
echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us
> <mailto:echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us>;
> srye at montana.com <mailto:srye at montana.com>
> Cc: missoulagov at cmslists.com
<mailto:missoulagov at cmslists.com>
> Subject: RE: [MissoulaGov] parking meters
>
>
> Solar!
>
>
> From: missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com
> <mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com>
> [mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com
> <mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com>] On Behalf
Of Rod
Austin
> Sent: Monday, December 07, 2009 8:14 AM
> To: 'Derek Goldman'; echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us
> <mailto:echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us>; srye at montana.com
> <mailto:srye at montana.com>
> Cc: missoulagov at cmslists.com
<mailto:missoulagov at cmslists.com>
> Subject: Re: [MissoulaGov] parking meters
>
>
> Who pays the power bill? Or would that come with your
parking
> fee? Rod
>
>
> From: missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com
> <mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com>
> [mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com
> <mailto:missoulagov-bounces at cmslists.com>] On Behalf
Of Derek
> Goldman
> Sent: Saturday, December 05, 2009 2:22 PM
> To: echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us
> <mailto:echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us>; srye at montana.com
> <mailto:srye at montana.com>
> Cc: missoulagov at cmslists.com
<mailto:missoulagov at cmslists.com>
> Subject: Re: [MissoulaGov] parking meters
>
>
> i wish we had a "like" button...
>
>
>
> _____
> Date: Sat, 5 Dec 2009 09:12:42 -0700
> From: echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us
> <mailto:echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us>
> To: srye at montana.com <mailto:srye at montana.com>
> CC: missoulagov at cmslists.com
<mailto:missoulagov at cmslists.com>
> Subject: Re: [MissoulaGov] parking meters
>
> I predict: in as little as five years we will be
looking back
> wishing
> our parking meters doubled as plug-ins for our fleet
of
electric
> vehicles.
>
> Ed Childers
>
>
> Stacy Rye wrote:
> Rod,
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> It's not the changing of habits that's the issue,
it's that
> kiosks are
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> inconvenient, and they could be difficult for
tourists and
> perhaps a
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> question of if it's not broke . . .
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I think the council needs to hear about this if new
parking
> meters/kiosks
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> are proposed.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Stacy
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> There are many issues to think through on what
actually gets
> put on the
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> street. There are other more modern ways than the
multi space
> meters and
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> we
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> will be exploring all of them. I think the feeling is
that
> with the new
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> streetscape it would be nice to clean it up even
more. And
> frankly I
> don't
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> think it would be that difficult to change habits. At
my age
> I sometimes
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> take change hard but do try to stay open to it.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> I do have to say that everyone's input is interesting
(I am a
> little
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> surprised) and noted.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Rod
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Messages and attachments sent to or from this e-mail
account
> pertaining
> to City business may be considered public or private
records
> depending
> on the message content. The City is often required by
law to
> provide
> public records to individuals requesting them. The
City is
> also required
> by law to protect private, confidential information.
This
> message is
> intended for the use of the individual or entity named
above.
> If you are
> not the intended recipient of this transmission,
please notify
the
> sender immediately, do not forward the message to
anyone, and
> delete all
> copies. Thank you
>
>
> _____
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 07 Dec 2009 11:05:40 -0700
> From: Michael Loftis <mloftis at wgops.com
> <mailto:mloftis at wgops.com>>
> Subject: Re: [MissoulaGov] Committee Update 12-2-09
(parking
> meters)
> To: missoulagov at cmslists.com
<mailto:missoulagov at cmslists.com>
> Message-ID: <814A79FDD7ABC5353935390A@[192.168.1.44]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii;
format=flowed
>
> (reply is inline)
>
> --On Friday, December 04, 2009 12:22 PM -0700 Rod
Austin
> <raustin at missouladowntownbid.org
> <mailto:raustin at missouladowntownbid.org>> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> We are currently looking a a different metering
system on
> N Higgins.
> Electronic gang meters are on our radar and this
may be a
> great place
>
>
> to
>
>
> try them.
>
>
>
> One of my concerns is that a *lot* of the LCD display
based
> multi-space (and single space meters) may not function
well
> during winter around
> here. I personally would prefer to pay via credit
card, or
> even cell txt or
> call from the comfort of the vehicle, than change, or
cash.
> As someone mentioned further along in this thread
waiting on
> someone else in this weather is painful at the least.
Also,
> as many have noted bill changers
>
> can also have a hard time when the temperatures are
this low.
>
> I'm sure our folks at the parking commission are
considering
> all of
> this, after all, they ultimately have to service and
maintain
> all of this kit!
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Mon, 7 Dec 2009 11:12:15 -0700
> From: Ed Childers <echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us
> <mailto:echilders at ci.missoula.mt.us>>
> Subject: Re: [MissoulaGov] parking meters
> To: Rod Austin <raustin at missouladowntownbid.org
> <mailto:raustin at missouladowntownbid.org>>
> Cc: "missoulagov at cmslists.com
> <mailto:missoulagov at cmslists.com>"
<missoulagov at cmslists.com
> <mailto:missoulagov at cmslists.com>>
> Message-ID: <4B1D457F.1050004 at ci.missoula.mt.us
> <mailto:4B1D457F.1050004 at ci.missoula.mt.us>>
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>
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
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> End of MissoulaGov Digest, Vol 46, Issue 5
> ******************************************
> _______________________________________________
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> _______________________________________________
>
> -----Please delete extra content when replying to
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> Note: This list is NOT an official service of the City Of
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>
>
>
>
> --
> Jordan Hess
>
> Email: jordan at montanatransit.com
<mailto:jordan at montanatransit.com>
> Mobile: 406-431-3222
_______________________________________________
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